From honest John to Abbott the good bloke: selling conservative values to Australia

One of the largest political graveyards is that occupied by former opposition leaders such as Mark Latham who promise in their first interviews to come out fighting. They excite their party base but alienate voters looking for pragmatic solutions. Tony Abbott is an exception. But his success has been…

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Tony Abbott is trying to send a positive message. Will it work? AAP/Alan Porritt

One of the largest political graveyards is that occupied by former opposition leaders such as Mark Latham who promise in their first interviews to come out fighting. They excite their party base but alienate voters looking for pragmatic solutions.

Tony Abbott is an exception. But his success has been less a reflection of his own talents than Labor’s own difficulties. Some of Labor’s problems have verged on self-harm: the “real Julia” fiasco of the last election and the mishandling of marriage equality are examples. To be fair to Labor, this is not an easy time to be in government, having to grapple with an economy in transition. It has been a dream run for Tony Abbott but rather like Geelong after Grand Final day in 2008, it all starts again now.

In the past 20 years, Labor has won two federal elections outright: 1993 and 2007. Both of these were elections at which voters perceived clear differences between the parties, cared about the result of the election and as a result felt positive about the political process, even Coalition voters.

Labor benefits by enthusiasm, the Coalition by disinterest. In the past year Julia Gillard has sought to re-energise Labor supporters and campaign on the party’s strengths. The Coalition does best when policy is less of an issue. In 1993 Labor won on policy; voters actually liked John Hewson more than Paul Keating.

So Tony Abbott’s challenge is to mount an energetic campaign but not a polarising one. For a conservative politician, polarisation is useful for motivating core supporters but as a tool it has to be kept strictly under control. John Howard baited the left to frenzy and won the swooning endorsement of conservative intellectuals, but this was not his public persona. Last year Mitt Romney alienated large groups of voters on principle.

Tony Abbott is determined to follow the example of Howard, not Romney. The opposition leader’s address to the National Press Club provides an outline of the Coalition’s approach: appeal to a general sense of discontent, focus on a few consensual issues (such as hostility to asylum seekers) and try to neutralise Labor’s advantage on health, the environment and education.

Julia Gillard’s address on Wednesday cast herself as a policy wonk, and appealed to the media on this basis. Abbott seeks to present himself to journalists as a “good bloke” and a compassionate conservative. The reference to indigenous issues in his address is part of this strategy.

The core aspect of Abbott’s critique of Labor is economic, but the days of voter excitement about economic policy ended with the death of socialism. Debt and deficits are a convenient talking point for conservatives, rather like education for Labor. Abbott also has to distinguish his approach from the “Austrian” economic theories of the hard right, such as his new business advisor Maurice Newman. These thinkers look forward to drastic de-leveraging of public and private debt and a consequent severe recession.

So Abbott’s economic appeal is historical. He evokes the “golden age” of the Howard government, promising to return voters to the summer of 2007 minus WorkChoices. The details of this radiant future are unclear: “some of the upward pressure on prices” will be removed for example. Does his passing reference to household wealth imply a strategy to boost house prices?

Cultural politics is a potential challenge for Abbott. Voters over time have become more liberal on social issues. Abbott’s avowed conservatism excites the conservative commentariat but scares some voters, particularly women. It took the Liberals a long time to recover from their late 1990s flirtation with the radical right. A focus on asylum seekers appeals to voters but it also placates social conservatives in the Liberal Party. It is impossible to keep Cory Bernardi silent but the current of Liberal opinion that sympathises with his positions has to be kept as quiet as possible.

In his Press Club address Abbott declared:

One of John Howard’s great achievements in stopping the boats was to rebuild public support for a large, non-discriminatory immigration program. An immigration program pitched to our economic needs and humanitarian obligations has not only been good for Australia, it’s helped to create Australia.

The argument that Howard’s asylum seeker policies contributed to public support for immigration is an article of faith on the business friendly centre-right. Abbott’s stand of “stop the boats” gives him space to espouse a cultural pluralism out of step with many Liberals. This is important for the Liberals’ electoral fortunes. At the 2010 election Abbott won support from both sides of the immigration debate in Sydney. Labor lost votes on border protection but many non-Anglo voters swung to the Liberals, or voted informal, in response to Labor’s opportunistic embrace of population sustainability. In 2010 the Liberals made major advances in the non-Anglo middle ring of Sydney suburbs, and in September they will target these “ethnic” seats.

Health and education are traditional areas of Labor strength, but at the 2010 election Labor lost significant ground in public opinion. Labor has worked hard to rebuild its advantage here. The Liberals will play defensive; vague rhetoric about community control is combined with promises to do more in the future when the budget has been resolved.

A long campaign lies ahead for Tony Abbott, but his priorities are clear, and his strategy is steeped in the values of the last Liberal government. It remains to be seen whether Abbott the “good bloke” resonates with John Howard’s Aussie battlers.

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67 Comments sorted by

  1. Grendelus Malleolus

    Senior Nerd

    Editor - is this article ready for publication? There seems to be an editorial note in the first para still...

    "One of the largest political graveyards is that occupied by former opposition leaders SUCH AS? who promise in their first interviews to come out fighting. They excite their party base but alienate voters looking for pragmatic solutions."

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  2. Anthony Nolan

    Ruminant

    Oh I don't know: why doesn't the Liberal Party outsource the responsibility of selling conservative values in Australia to Coles and Woolworths, maybe Macca's too. Just kinda pump it in, day after day, with special attention to ANZAC Day and Australia day and militarism as the best opportunities to really pump that stuff into people's heads. Oh, wait a minute...

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    1. Grendelus Malleolus

      Senior Nerd

      In reply to Mat Hardy

      What - more than he has done already? Perhaps he has written out of election calculations all those unlikely to vote for him regardless of how he pimps his image.

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    2. Felix MacNeill

      Environmental Manager

      In reply to Mat Hardy

      Hey, Mat, it isn't just the non-blokes he's alienated, but quite a lot of us 'blokes' who happen to know, care for, respect and have valued relationships with people who don't fit the description of 'bloke', either through gender, sexuality or personality.

      Mind you, there's nothing necessarily so wrong with blokiness, provided it isn't used as a Trojan horse for insensitivity, bigotry and general stupidity.

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    3. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Felix MacNeill

      True.

      Bloke n. A physically 'masculine' man. A person with a penis.

      Nothing in that definition is behavioral.

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  3. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    I am a voter who decides on which party "seems" to be the best to govern the country - based on my criteria of what constitutes good governance. I am not a steadfast Labor or Liberal, or Greens or independent voter.

    I liked the goverments of Hawke, Keating and Howard.I did not like the Rudd goverment, and I have tried ever so hard to like the Gillard goverment. But something just seems to be missing.

    We should be glad that we survived the GFC in good shape (and I am).

    But somehow Ms Gillard…

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    1. Wade Macdonald

      Technician

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Labor have done their dash with me and Abbott isn't any better. I think this election will see me vote as independent 'as possible' given 'preferences' which annoy me no end.

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    2. Judith Olney

      Ms

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Stephen, I think you probably have summed up politics for many people. I'm already tired of the endless political game playing that we have been subjected to, particularly since the minority government was formed.

      I'm in no way a political extremist, so the polarisation tactics used by the Liberals has left me without any desire to vote for an Abbott led party. The Liberals are just too far gone on the extreme conservatism path for me to even preference them highly, at federal level. Although…

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    3. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Judith Olney

      Those sentiments are what lead to minority governments.

      Let's not forget, although the Coalition got less votes, neither they nor Labor won outright.
      Donkey voting upswing was quite notable as well.

      Perhaps, this time, it'll be split three ways instead of two large and the rest mixed.

      In that it would still be a minority government only it won't be the same kind of dogfight and it may even work better.

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    4. Judith Olney

      Ms

      In reply to Emma Anderson

      Hi Emma, I have no problem with minority governments, in reality it has been good for the country, its the unreality of the mud slinging, and muck racking that is tedious in the extreme, but that would have occurred, minority government or not.

      I would love to see the smaller parties, and the independents gain even more power, and the major parties less.

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    5. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Judith Olney

      Indeed!

      It would have been nice if certain individuals in the parliament took this as an opportunity to work on policy rather than chuck tantrums.

      It would seem those individuals aren't from minor parties or are independents though. ^^^guess who^^^

      I'm looking forward to the same thing.

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  4. Colin MacGillivray

    Retired architect

    The "government" won't change completely in September even if the Coalition win. The small number of decision making elected politicians (backbenchers do nothing) are hugely out numbered by bureaucrats. The latter have been advising and running the show for years and they don't change their advice much to suit the party in power.
    In the 2013 it's hard to tell the difference between the two sides of parliament. Carbon tax might be the only one.

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    1. Robert McDougall

      Small Business Owner

      In reply to Colin MacGillivray

      here's a thought. If the coalition does win the election, thereby benefitting from unrelentingly negative conduct in parliament i.e. "no-alition" does this mean that that particular approach is effective? Does this mean that the Coalition can look forward to a "block everything no matter how trivial" response in kind from Labor in Opposition? Do we as a country really want that? Should we as a country reward that kind of behaviour in parliament? Can we as a country afford another 3 or so years of the same games played in high places? Or would we prefer all sides to actually roll up their sleeves and do whats right for the country and not just whats right for themselves and their party?

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    2. Henry Verberne

      Former IT Professional

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      Assuming the Coalition wins the (eventual) election I could not blame Labor for adopting a "block everything" approach though it is likely to be bad for the country. You reap as you sow!

      I cannot vote for the opposition under Abbott and I have fears that the Mr Nice guy approach that is now coming from Abbott (leave the nasty stuff to Pyne, Abetz, etc) will give way to a quite hard line stance on many social and economic issues.

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    3. Felix MacNeill

      Environmental Manager

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      Robert, funnily enough, though it may not be perfect, I thought that the work of Labor, Grens and the two country independents on the carbon pricing policies was one of th few examples we've seen recntly of differnt sides rolling up their sleeves and doing the hard slog of negotiating around their differnces, in a spirit of comprmise, in order to at least try to get a god result for the country.

      As I recall, the Coalition were invited to joing that process but decidd not to soil their hands by being a party to an actual attempt at a workable solution.

      What we got from this process is still too little to late, but at least it was a start and better than absolutely nothing.

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    4. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Felix MacNeill

      It makes it all the more rich that the coalition would espouse their economic credentials and the limits of this in the carbon price/tax.

      After all, if they're so damn good at that stuff, why didn't they pull their fingers out and chip in?

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    5. Jennifer Norton

      statistician, researcher, entrepreneur

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      Really good points Robert.

      Abbott's behaviour in this (and many other arenas) suggests that he lacks "Theory of Mind" and hence empathy. Theory of Mind is something that most of us develop in late childhood, and allows us to recognise that other people have different thoughts to us (their own minds), and that their thoughts (feelings etc) are also valid.

      ToM is also about being able to see 'fairness' and act fairly. People without Theory of Mind believe it's OK for them to do X (be rude…

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    6. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      That's what the ALP did in opposition.

      Expect ALP to do the same.

      The difference is that the Libs will not keep complaining about it

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    7. Alice Kelly

      sole parent

      In reply to Ken Swanson

      Ken, I don't ever remember an opposition who has whined as much, or for as long, as Julie, Tony, Christopher, Eric, George, Joe, Barnaby, Scott, Warren etc. They have had a 25 point Hit List of topical points to whinge about (the other side) for the last couple of years. And they are directed to refer to it every time there is a camera. This however distracts from a proper scrutiny of policy direction they may have. They never fully talk about it. They have to work back to the 25 slag points ad finitum.
      They do nothing but complain. They have been complaining for three years. What makes you think they will stop.

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    8. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Jennifer Norton

      "He has never been able to imagine (or stomach) why he didn't win power. Even worse, someone quite unlike him became PM--female, not Catholic, not upper class/privileged background--a job he believed he deserved by virtue of who he is."

      And your proof for such a stupid assertion is?

      "ToM is also about being able to see 'fairness' and act fairly. People without Theory of Mind believe it's OK for them to do X (be rude, lie, bully, hit their siblings, block every trivial policy in Parliament…

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    9. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Alice Kelly

      Alice

      If you are opposed to the policies of the other side of politics, for example a carbon tax, a mining tax, a union oriented Fair Work Act then I fail to see how you can do other than to communicate talking points to the public via the media in the hope public opinion may sway the government.

      If you fundamentally believe that someone like Craig Thomson should not be in Parliament because of the credibility cloud over him which is being ignored by Julia Gillard. If you think the investigation by Fair Work Australia into Thomson is taking too long, then you are obligated to say so in the hope public opinion will sway the government. As it turns out Gillard and FWA have finally done what they should have a long time ago. Do you really think this would have happened without Tony Abbott's approach?

      Do you classify this as "complaining"?

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    10. Robert McDougall

      Small Business Owner

      In reply to Ken Swanson

      sorry Ken, thats not entirely in line with my memories of the last time they were in opposition. John Howard also had a majority. I have never seen the behaviour displayed by the coalition over this last term repeated in any other term of parliament. The only occasion i have seen this behaviour displayed is in the american Tea Party movement, perhaps it gave them the idea? This seems to be a new development in our parliamentary system.

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    11. Robert McDougall

      Small Business Owner

      In reply to Felix MacNeill

      From my observations i would have to agree with you. much better approach than having a dummy spit and saying "no no no" ad nauseum because you didn't get what you felt you were "entitled" to.

      Theres probably an early developmental problem being displayed here.

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  5. Robert McDougall

    Small Business Owner

    i remember a documentary which connected conservative values with low IQ

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    1. John Newton

      Author Journalist

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      Who said 'Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative.'? Ah yes, it was that clever dick John Stuart Mill.

      But there's a couple of things to remember in an Australian context. Good blokes or not, never more than 30 per cent of the Australian electorate has ever voted for the Liberals. Without their – even more conservative – coalition partners (and the first four letters of coalition provide a clue) they could never achieve government.

      And another thing: the oft reviled as loony and whacky Greens usually get more votes than the Nats.

      So, perhaps, returning to Mr Mill, there are less stupid people in Australia than some would think.

      Will the Australian people really buy Mr Abbott's sudden re-conversion to the climate change denialist ranks (cf the Auburn speech)? Will they buy the Green Army? Repealing the carbon tax?

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    2. Wade Macdonald

      Technician

      In reply to Robert McDougall

      Yeah well, if you consider Labor to be non-conservative then why do they not have the 'IQ' to manage a budget?

      My recommendation would be to change the TV channel from that documentary, as some other channels have programs that require a higher IQ.

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    3. Wade Macdonald

      Technician

      In reply to John Newton

      Quote...And another thing: the oft reviled as loony and whacky Greens usually get more votes than the Nats.

      Yes....the UN funds through ENGO's to support the UN's love of control/money through environmentalism has changed some with a low IQ to vote Green.

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    4. Robert McDougall

      Small Business Owner

      In reply to Wade Macdonald

      I think that the point of the documentary is that people with low IQ's find it hard to "imagine" other than what they know and have difficulty adapting to change and perhaps understanding alternative viewpoints. So they stick to what they know and are generally resistant to change, hence find it more comfortable to go along with "conservative" as it is easier to do that than actually take the time to research and form an independant opinion irrespective of your IQ.

      I didn't refer to either Labor…

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  6. Robert Tony Brklje

    retired

    I will never get how 'conservative' politics could be furthest possible from the definition of the conservative. Reality 'conservative' politics is in fact exploitative politics, it seeks to exploit the environment, it seeks to exploit dwindling resources, it seeks to exploit Australian workers and of course it seeks to exploit the electorate.
    Truth 'conservative' politics, purposefully and deceitfully seeks to hide behind the word conservative in order to present themselves as something they most…

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    1. Felix MacNeill

      Environmental Manager

      In reply to Robert Tony Brklje

      Couldn't agree more - the current Coal-ition are ideologically-driven hard right neo-liberals. Though most of it was negative and backward, John Howard lead one of the most radical and change-making governments since Whitlam. It's just that the mdia parrot and too many people follow the mantra of "coalition conservative; labor left.'

      A bit like 'four legs god; two legs bad.'

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    2. Wade Macdonald

      Technician

      In reply to Felix MacNeill

      Felix...no factions are better than the other. They all see public consultation as anyone who agrees with their agenda.

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  7. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Thanks Judith....

    I should have put Mr Pyne (The Hon) on top of the list actually.

    They say if wishes were horses we'd all be jockeys (or something similar), but one of my wishes is for someone in the political arena to display some leadership qualities and be able to answer questions directly, instead verbally inventing a thousand ways to NOT answer a question.

    Most politicians espouse a touchy feely, want to make Australia a better place type of response as to why they went into politics, but end up just as robotic and dogmatic as the collective.

    It would be nice to think that with ALL the world's problems in the 21st century we just might get some politicians who can think outside of the party dogma and offer some relevant and insightful ways to go forward.

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  8. Pamela H.

    logged in via email @hotmail.com

    Tony Abbott is also determined to follow (copy) John Howard with his less than original "Who can you trust?" speech.

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    1. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Pamela H.

      By now I'd hope the electorate knows the answer:

      None of them.

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  9. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Judith

    I don't believe it has been GOOD for Australia..............it has led to the Gillard government having to compromise in ways that have compromised it (the govnt.) It has led to regrettable instances of trying to shore up a majority by somewhat shallow and dubious methods.

    For better or worse a strong government is what we vote for - nobody wants to see weak government struggling to stay in power.

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    1. Alice Kelly

      sole parent

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Stephen, I probably don't believe as you do that strong and weak, are important to effective governing. Consensus, considered debate, respect, intelligence, are probably higher on my dream list for government. There is probably more for me to fear from a bunch of entitled wealthy male bullies, (and julie and sophie), strong, (with a mandate). No, much prefer minority government, they can't ram as much mandate politics down everyones throats.

      And even in the liberal party, I don't see how behaving in a strong manner has much to do with considered policy. It's not that simple is it.

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  10. Emma Anderson

    Artist and Science Junkie

    First they tried to rebrand him as woman friendly, now you're saying they're going down the good bloke road.

    History seems to suggest he is not woman friendly. I wonder if that's also the case with the good bloke brand.

    If a good bloke chucks tantrums when he doesn't get what he wants, and ignores opportunities to have input in things he thinks he's better equipped to handle, and then complains about the results. Then I suppose TA is a good bloke, after all.

    Do the PR people really think that little of the Australian people?

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  11. Alice Kelly

    sole parent

    At the last election Tony made a lot of promises about leading a kinder more considerate government, if elected.

    I haven't seen any evidence for this in his behaviour since. Except his latest round of promises. Bluff, name calling, blanket negativity, and lying, seems to describe much of his behaviour.

    If he lost the next election, how long would it take for Malcolm to take the leadership. Would the two parties who call themselves the coalition then be able to sell a conservative government to the public. I dunno. They need some sort of re-construction.

    Personally I can't stand the idea of Tony pontificating on the world-stage, or any-where, on my behalf.

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    1. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Alice Kelly

      And I cringe every time I see and especially hear Julia Gillard pontificating on the world stage supposedly speaking for all of us.
      She only speaks for 50.1% of us, and now according to the polls, a lot less than that.

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  12. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Alice

    Can it be guaranteed that if Labor wine the next election, Kevin Rudd will NOT become P.M.?

    Now as much as Mr Abbot may be seen to pontificate and swagger,K.Rudd in my opinion is the benchmark above all others in this regard. I cringe every time I see him on the telly. His mock sincerity makes my skin crawl.

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    1. Alice Kelly

      sole parent

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      hi stephen, I agree, I have no idea, I would guess no, I have met people who worked with him, it's all true. I think he's burned to many bridges in reality to ever have the numbers. Much of the media seems to flirt with the idea.
      Malcolm, who only lost by one vote to tony, seems to be another story hardly ever discussed. Why. He seems to represent the more traditional liberal values of the party, but he's disliked in their party. Maybe tonys forceful nature is so all-consuming, they've forgotten.
      There are a great many politicians I cringe at, Labour, Lib., Nat., Green, and Bob.
      The point for me, is about what is the least repulsive "culture", I can see within the parties on offer, which policies more or less describe what I would want for the future. Tonys gang aint it.

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    2. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      K Rudd or TA: both pontificating politicians.

      Malcolm Turnbull: also a narcissist but more digestible than TA

      If it has to be the mirror parties (another liberal party and the lying-gnashing coalition) let Julia keep the job and Turnbull in opposition.

      Not saying the current govt is preferable, but seriously, at least they have policies. And not just temper tantrums.

      Come to think of it, shag the lot of them.

      Maybe we should all vote Greens and have Adam Bandt as PM. At least his smile is genuine and he doesn't give people the creeps.

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    3. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Alice Kelly

      Abbott has brought the ALP to its knees politically.
      The polls during Turnbull's leadership were nowhere near Abbott's.
      Why would the Liberals make such a change?
      He is the leader they wish the Liberals had right now because they know they can beat him.

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    4. Alice Kelly

      sole parent

      In reply to Ken Swanson

      Ken, I don't see things as simply as Labour vs Liberal, nor do always admire the way Julia speaks. I don't like everything about our federal government, but dislike the opposition more.
      I don't see things the way you do.
      I now recall a reply, to me, from you,(in the past), which was to my mind, pure nasty.
      I also don't believe Craig Thompson is guilty, until he has been shown to be. Computer generated signatures prove nothing. And nothing done by the HSU under Williams would surprise me. I suspect dates and times could be interesting. I like you am waiting to see what happens in court. Here-say isn't evidence.
      You want to reply to every single letter I write, why?

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    5. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Alice Kelly

      I disagree with many of your assertions.
      I respect your right to put them.
      Respect my right to respond to them.
      If you wish to converse then so be it.

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  13. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Tony

    aren't you being a hypocrite for slamming someone's views, when ToM would suggest we need to embrace other opinions and views.

    Open your heart Tony.......

    And ToM sounds a little like the Emperor's clothes or pop-psychology. As a concept it's fine, but to make it a pseudo-science of it (as it were) requires a leap faith.

    And you seem to have made that jump quite successfully.

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    1. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      I tend to agree. TA appears to be a narrow minded self serving wanker. That doesn't mean he lacks a theory of mind. Churning that out is a cheap shot.

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  14. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Hi Alice

    Consensus, considered debate, respect, intelligence - these would be on everyone's list, except for say Robert Mugabe, Kim Jong-un, et al.

    I think you would prefer a Roman senate type of government rather than a party-based system. But that still requires a majority vote to get anywhere.

    Looking at you criteria it's hard sometimes to detect any of them in the current crop of politicians - but that's probably a cheap shot.

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    1. Alice Kelly

      sole parent

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Hi stephen. Why say "cheap shot", I did say "dream". If you wish to "put me down" rather than debate, that's a more of the same, don't you think.
      I will disagree with you. There are some I consider more authentic than others.
      I welcome the debate about political party culture, and whether tony reflects the best the liberal party can offer to the electorate.

      what are your thoughts

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  15. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Alice

    you misunderstood........the cheap shot I was referring to was MINE (not yours)

    Meaning that it's easy in forums like this to take cheap shots at anything and everything - in this case I was using your list of qualities and saying it would be hard to find politicians with any of them.........a cheap shot from moi!

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  16. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    Ken

    I think you over-estimate Mr Abbott's talents. Julia seems to out-poll him in the preferred PM stakes.

    And I think what has brought the Labor party to it's knees is the Labor party.

    They should be wearing a button that says - this button will self-destruct at the next election.

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    1. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Polls today Gillard 41%; Abbott 39%

      I agree ALP have blundered which is amplified by Abbott. He holds a mirror up to Gillard and she does not like it.

      It is his job to do so until the election writs are issued after which he announces his policies. What do people expect an opposition to do outside an election campaign. All parties when in opposition act the same.

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  17. Stephen John Ralph

    carer

    But it needn't be Ken.....................perhaps that's why politics today seems so boring and entrenched.
    I can't stand watching them on teev.

    It makes Q & A a real pain - hearing them spout the same diatribe every time after time. Tonight is Amanda bloody Vanstone, she's not even an MP anymore but she sounds like one...yada yada yada

    Politicians are in the arena as representatives of their electorates.....not as stand up comedians or biffo fighters.

    Let them criticise the government of the day's policies where it is warranted, but PLEASE not in the usual carping negative way. And let them say what they might do............they dont have to sign it in blood, just give us an idea.

    A government can't always be wrong, and an opposition can't always be right.

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    1. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Stephen John Ralph

      Agree with you on Vanstone. I could think of many more entertaining people as a representative of the right of politics.

      The opposition used to act in the way you said until the 1980s when Hawke and Keating were around. The Libs would often release policies mid term. Hawke and Keating then had them market researched. If the public liked them the ALP adopted them. This was ok for the ALP government but did not do much for the Liberals. Neither party has done it since. Howard did not do it the lead up to beating Keating; Rudd did not do it in the lead up to beating Howard.

      The problem with agreeing too often with your opponent is that it works in favour of the incumbent government. If the voters think that policies of both sides are somehow blended, they will never change. Politics is about power, always has been. If your are no in power you are a political failure.

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    1. Ken Swanson

      Geologist

      In reply to Emma Anderson

      Great clip.

      Robert Menzies' concept of the "forgotten people" that were ignored by both big labour and big business comes to mind. The two extremes are still with us today. The HSU and Fairfax. The AWU and Murdoch. I will add a new one, Big Green, another organization type completely alienated from the people. There are many other examples.

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  18. Pat Moore

    gardener

    Yes, thanks for the link Emma. George Carlin is saying what Occupy said, what the anti globalization protests said, what the rioting "austerity"- subjected Europeans are saying etc etc. There is a massive Anglosphere & EU wide nay saying to the entrenched 1% global elite's economic & social progroms but the disempowered populace is not organized into any viable opposition & is purposefully kept this way.

    Political parties give the appearance & window dressing of a citizen-run democracy but…

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    1. Emma Anderson

      Artist and Science Junkie

      In reply to Pat Moore

      I noticed that too! And it was long before Occupy. Carlin died in 2008.

      Are we seeing hippies mach 2?

      What I find really cool about Occupy is that although you're going to get blocs try and in some sites succeed in running it, by and large it's almost spontaneous, grass roots and ultimately 'non wing'.

      The left/right divide is passe and eventually those that cling to either (including some of those blocs, but also the powers that be) are going to have to face up to the fact that the bottom line is people are pretty much sick of the lot of those bastards and the shit they're shoveling on us from up high.

      What comes after that is - I can hope it will be very different - but history shows it will be probably be a case same shit, different asshole. The social experiment continues.

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    1. Jennifer Norton

      statistician, researcher, entrepreneur

      In reply to Greg Hooper

      Your link gets a security warning from my Virus Protection as a phishing site.

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