tag:theconversation.com,2011:/us/topics/choosing-a-university-13049/articlesChoosing a university – The Conversation2019-11-21T18:57:13Ztag:theconversation.com,2011:article/1251812019-11-21T18:57:13Z2019-11-21T18:57:13ZDon’t despair if your teen wants to major in history instead of science<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302950/original/file-20191121-524-faaqy5.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&rect=6%2C27%2C1995%2C1293&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">Historians' work looks like meaningful disagreements around how to grapple with an ambiguous, complicated past. Here, 'Pi' sculpture by Evan Grant Penny, Wellington St., Toronto.</span> <span class="attribution"><span class="source">(Brendan Lynch/Flickr)</span>, <a class="license" href="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/">CC BY-NC</a></span></figcaption></figure><p>It might be your worst nightmare. Your child, sitting at the kitchen table, slides you a brochure from the local university.</p>
<p><em>“I’ve been thinking of majoring in history.”</em></p>
<p>Before you panic and begin calling the nearest computer science department, or worse, begin to crack those tired barista jokes, hear me out. This might just be the thing that your child, and our society, needs.</p>
<p>Choosing to become a history major is a future-friendly investment. A history degree teaches skills that are in short supply today: the ability to interpret context, and — crucially — where we’ve been, so as to better understand the world around us today and tomorrow.</p>
<p>We’ve never needed knowledge of history and the skills that come with the discipline more than we do now. Not only is it a good choice of a major for all the usual selfish reasons — <a href="https://www.conferenceboard.ca/e-library/abstract.aspx?did=9463">you’ll likely get a good job, even if it takes a bit longer than the STEM disciplines, and more importantly you’ll probably be very happy with it</a>. </p>
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<img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=434&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=434&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=434&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=545&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=545&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302739/original/file-20191120-483-5tcsev.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=545&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px">
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<span class="caption">Your child majoring in history is a future-friendly investment.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">(Shutterstock)</span></span>
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<p>But for our society more generally, we need a generation with deep capacities to acknowledge context and ambiguity. This idea of ambiguity not only pertains to interpreting the past based on a diverse body of incomplete sources, voices and outcomes, but also how our contemporary judgements of that record shape our choices today.</p>
<p>Our whole society hurts when students turn their back on history. A sense of history — where we have come from, the shared anchors of democratic society, the why and how of our current moment in time — is critical. </p>
<h2>Not enough historians</h2>
<p><em>“Won’t you be lonely as a history major?”</em></p>
<p>When you’re visiting a campus library, take a look: you’ll see a lot of students reading their engineering notes, maybe some doing computer science exercises, even some English literature or political science essays being written. What you won’t see is many students flipping through their history books. </p>
<p>That’s because there aren’t all that many history majors left in many North American universities: <a href="https://oipa.info.yorku.ca/data-hub/quick-facts/quick-facts-undergraduate-headcount/">York University has gone from 1,217 majors in 2011-12 to 527 seven years later</a>; at the University of Waterloo, where I teach, we’ve gone from 227 to 89. </p>
<p>This is part of the broader <a href="https://www.historians.org/publications-and-directories/perspectives-on-history/april-2013/data-show-a-decline-in-history-majors">decline in history majors</a> which has seen enrolments <a href="https://www.historians.org/publications-and-directories/perspectives-on-history/may-2016/the-decline-in-history-majors">essentially</a> <a href="https://www.historians.org/publications-and-directories/perspectives-on-history/february-2018/enrollment-declines-continue-aha-survey-again-shows-fewer-undergraduates-in-history-courses">crash</a>.</p>
<p>Why? On the face of it, it’s surprising that students who play <a href="https://www.gamesradar.com/how-popular-is-assassins-creed-the-series-has-sold-over-140-million-copies/"><em>Assassin’s Creed</em></a>, listen to <a href="https://www.popularmechanics.com/culture/g25807523/best-history-podcasts/">historical podcasts</a> and watch historically themed television have turned their backs on the history major. </p>
<p>There are three reasons. First, education and law have seen tightening labour markets and <a href="https://www.ouac.on.ca/statistics/olsas-application-statistics/">falling</a> <a href="https://www.ouac.on.ca/statistics/archive/">applications</a>. Traditionally history was seen as a good preparation for being a teacher or a lawyer. Second, there’s the overall “crisis of the humanities,” <a href="https://www.universityaffairs.ca/opinion/in-my-opinion/much-emphasis-stem-fields-universities/">where STEM is seen as leaving liberal arts behind within universities more generally</a>.</p>
<p>But also, historians (and their university departments) simply haven’t made the case for why history matters. </p>
<p>We stress critical thinking and writing — which, sure, a history degree does get — but often fail to get to the heart of why a history degree just might be the best training for the 21st century.</p>
<h2>Macdonald analysis</h2>
<p><em>“History? Is that so you can learn how to write?”</em></p>
<p>You can certainly learn how to write in history. But you can do that in any other arts discipline, and they’ll also teach you similar critical thinking skills. </p>
<p>Historians can put these skills to work to understand our world today. Take John A. Macdonald, Canada’s first prime minister. The question for historians is not simply how he should be judged and commemorated today, but also how he should be understood within the context of his time. </p>
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<img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302728/original/file-20191120-467-1isy0ao.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px">
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<span class="caption">Audience members listen at a 2014 conference by Queen’s University and the Sir John A. Macdonald Bicentennial Commission, Sir John A. Macdonald: Then and Now.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">(Queen's University, Flickr)</span></span>
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<p>In the 1990s, historians such as Timothy A. Stanley debated Macdonald’s legacy, pointing out the <a href="https://hssh.journals.yorku.ca/index.php/hssh/article/view/4598">inherent racism</a> of the 1885 Chinese Immigration Act; others such as Jack Granatstein lamented that students were likely to learn more about Louis Riel than Macdonald himself, despite, in Granatstein’s view, the latter’s accomplishments being “<a href="https://www.harpercollins.com/9780002008952/who-killed-canadian-history-revised-edition/">more important and much longer lasting</a>.”</p>
<p>But those in wider society began to truly grapple with Macdonald’s legacy only in the last five or so years. </p>
<h2>Forced reconsideration</h2>
<p>The 2014 publication of James Daschuk’s <a href="https://uofrpress.ca/Books/C/Clearing-the-Plains2"><em>Clearing the Plains: Disease, Politics of Starvation, and the Loss of Indigenous Life</em></a>, convincingly argued that Macdonald used a deliberate policy of starvation to help “clear the plains” of Indigenous people. </p>
<p>This book, along with the release of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission’s <a href="http://www.trc.ca/about-us/trc-findings.html">final report</a>, forced a reconsideration of how historians and society should teach or commemorate Macdonald today. </p>
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<img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=800&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=800&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=800&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=1005&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=1005&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/302029/original/file-20191116-66979-1j5odh9.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=1005&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px">
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<span class="caption">The pub formerly known as Sir John’s Public House in Kingston, Ont., located at the site of John A. Macdonald’s former law office, has changed its name to simply ‘Public House.’</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">(Shutterstock)</span></span>
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<p>In some cases, municipal governments have removed statues <a href="https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/john-a-macdonald-statue-victoria-city-hall-lisa-helps-1.4782065">(as in Victoria)</a>, or fostered ongoing conversations with Indigenous communities (as in <a href="https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-in-kingston-an-agonizing-question-what-to-do-about-sir-john-a/">Kingston</a>, Ont.). </p>
<p><a href="https://www.thestar.com/opinion/contributors/thebigdebate/2018/08/21/should-statues-of-sir-john-a-macdonald-be-removed-yes.html">Historians</a> <a href="https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/analysis/renaming-monuments-is-closer-look-at-history-443377973.html">and their arguments</a> have been at the heart of these <a href="https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/john-a-macdonald-statue-regina-vandalism-1.4795082">debates over Macdonald’s legacy</a>.</p>
<p>In historians’ professional <a href="https://www.tvo.org/video/tear-down-this-name">disagreements</a> we can see the <a href="http://christophermoorehistory.blogspot.com/2019/06/john-macdonald-and-reconciliation.html">importance of history at work</a>: it looks like meaningful disagreements around how to grapple with an ambiguous, complicated past. </p>
<h2>Debate that stripped name</h2>
<p>In 2018 there was a debate within the Canadian Historical Association that resulted in stripping Macdonald’s name from its long-standing best scholarly book award.</p>
<p>On the one hand, some historians saw the honour bestowed on Macdonald’s legacy by naming the highest prize as inappropriate <a href="https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/a-key-player-in-indigenous-cultural-genocide-historians-erase-sir-john-a-macdonalds-name-from-book-prize">given Macdonald’s record; others, highlighting Macdonald’s nation-building role, opted to vote in favour of keeping the prize name as it was</a>. </p>
<p>Same historical record, different judgements. The ultimate vote was to — correctly, in my view — strip the name from the prize.</p>
<p>The weighing of historical context and grappling with ambiguity, on display during the Macdonald debate but even more so everyday within classrooms across the country, lie at the heart of what makes history as a discipline special. </p>
<h2>Change the world through history</h2>
<p><em>“I’m still not convinced. Why does what happened in the past matter for today?”</em></p>
<p>Historians don’t study history so they can know the future. Yet knowing where our society has been — and how to grapple with ambiguity and context — means that a historian is well equipped to interpret the world around us and where it might be going.</p>
<p>Put down the science brochures. If your high schooler really wants to be a history major, don’t panic. Smile, knowing that they’re taking the first step to a deeper understanding of the world around them.</p>
<p>[ <em>You’re smart and curious about the world. So are The Conversation’s authors and editors.</em> <a href="https://theconversation.com/ca/newsletters?utm_source=TCCA&utm_medium=inline-link&utm_campaign=newsletter-text&utm_content=youresmart">You can read us daily by subscribing to our newsletter</a>. ]</p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/125181/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>Ian Milligan receives funding from the Andrew W. Mellon Foundation, the Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council, the Ontario Ministry of Economic Development, Job Creation and Trade, the United States Institute of Museum and Library Services, Compute Canada, and the University of Waterloo.</span></em></p>Put down the science brochures. If your high schooler really wants to be a history major, smile, knowing that they’re taking the first step to a deeper understanding of the world around them.Ian Milligan, Associate Professor of History, University of WaterlooLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.tag:theconversation.com,2011:article/456992015-08-25T19:59:58Z2015-08-25T19:59:58ZHow does your choice of university affect your future?<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92326/original/image-20150819-12433-1b0175h.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">The graduate employment market is tough. Can your choice of uni affect your outcomes?</span> <span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ricklibrarian/3988414957/">Richard Roche/Flickr</a>, <a class="license" href="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/">CC BY-SA</a></span></figcaption></figure><p>Last year’s graduate labour market was the <a href="https://theconversation.com/graduating-into-a-weak-job-market-why-so-many-grads-cant-find-work-45222">toughest on record</a>. More people completing degrees and fewer jobs meant lower rates of full-time employment. A third of recent graduates seeking full-time work in 2014 were still looking four months after completing their studies.</p>
<p>While job growth might improve in coming years, finding employment still won’t be easy. Student numbers are still increasing, which will ensure continued strong competition for graduate jobs. No student can do much about total enrolments or the overall number of jobs. But they can possibly improve their own career prospects. </p>
<h2>Does type of university attended affect a graduate’s first job?</h2>
<p>One big question is whether which university you attend makes a difference. The <a href="http://myuniversity.gov.au/">MyUniversity website</a> has some specific university information, but most academic research groups similar universities together. This helps take account of factors other than university attended that might affect the results, such as the course taken and the graduate’s personal attributes.</p>
<p>The Australian Graduate Survey (<a href="http://www.graduatecareers.com.au/research/researchreports/">AGS</a>) reports on employment and salary about four months after course completion. The 2014 survey found a salary advantage for graduates of universities in the <a href="https://go8.edu.au/">Group of Eight</a>, which includes the nation’s most research-intensive universities. After taking into account course and gender, the salary premium was around 6% for graduates aged under 25 in their first full-time job. </p>
<p>This advantage halved to about 3% after controlling for average <a href="http://www.uac.edu.au/atar/">ATAR</a> scores at each university. This result suggests that some, but certainly not all, of the salary premium is due to the prior academic ability of graduates who went to Group of Eight universities.</p>
<p>Interestingly, after controlling again for gender and course studied, the type of university attended did not significantly affect graduates’ probability of having a job within four months of course completion. </p>
<h2>Longer-term consequences of university attended</h2>
<p>Four months out is very soon to judge the impact of a degree. Last year, the Grattan Institute used data from the <a href="https://www.melbourneinstitute.com/hilda/">HILDA survey</a> to look at longer-term outcomes. HILDA is a general social survey, with people of all ages, that also asks its respondents where they went to university. </p>
<p>After statistical controls for various personal attributes, years of work experience and course studied, the <a href="http://grattan.edu.au/report/mapping-australian-higher-education-2014-15/">Grattan HILDA study</a> found that what type of university a person attended did not make much difference to whether or not a person had a job. This echoes the four months out results. </p>
<p>While employment rates are similar across university groups, the Grattan HILDA study found a lifetime income advantage from attending either a Group of Eight university or a <a href="https://www.atn.edu.au/">technology university</a> compared to other universities. The advantage was about 6%. </p>
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<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92328/original/image-20150819-12421-i7ep8k.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
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<span class="caption">The uni you attend matters less than the course you study.</span>
<span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/iansand/2705255669/">Ian Sanderson/Flickr</a>, <a class="license" href="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/">CC BY</a></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>This study did not directly take account of ATAR, but did include social background in its analysis. <a href="http://www.ncver.edu.au/wps/portal/vetdataportal/restricted/publicationContent/!ut/p/a1/lZDBbsIwEES_pQeOkdfGiZ1jCmodBEKCViW-IMd2glEwgbion1-DeqW0extpduftIIk2SHp1ca0K7uhVd9Uy25aYTISgMFsKkUHJXt5Wa_E-BpyhDySR1D70YYcqry_2vB126mzNCPrPunP6dmkYAWGYXL29aq2xg2v9TWlnUJXj3DKr64RpgxOaZnmiTKMT2jQca10zTklEqSIK3JkC_kQaLZPXQlA2jzuUEyinz2LK8gVE84_hl4gqMrC7ISJF638-NXtEHb92-9NJFrHlow_2K6DNw5r7w4Hvm3m24jBOu_bpG9NyqGM!/dl5/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/">Other research </a> shows a link between socio-economic status and ATAR. </p>
<h2>Why do outcomes differ between universities?</h2>
<p>What our research cannot fully explain is why we find earnings differences. Factors other than university attended probably play some part. As the starting salaries analysis suggests, people with relatively high ATARs are likely to have abilities and attributes that would be rewarded in the labour market irrespective of which university they choose.</p>
<p>Although personal attributes are almost certainly important, some universities might be better than others at developing students’ knowledge and skills. This is hard to measure objectively, but universities differ in student-staff ratios and student satisfaction with teaching. Satisfaction information is also available on <a href="http://myuniversity.gov.au/">MyUniversity</a>.</p>
<p>Some universities may do better on other non-academic factors that help students. These include social opportunities with people who may be useful in a future career, work placements while studying, and careers service departments. </p>
<p>Or it could be that, on average, the student experience is fairly similar between universities, but employers believe, rightly or wrongly, that graduates from some universities are better and pay a higher salary accordingly. In other words, employers may take degrees from certain types of university as a signal of ability and talent.</p>
<p>For students seeking a high financial return on their higher education, we should note that course studied is usually more important that the university attended. Given the potential career-long consequences of course choice, what to study is the first question, and where to study it the second question potential students should answer.</p>
<h2>Seek lots of information when making a university choice</h2>
<p>While the research on graduate outcomes by university type has interesting results, it should only be a very general guide to student choice. It is inevitably backward-looking, when universities are constantly changing and innovating. Future income is only one factor to consider, and not necessarily the most important. </p>
<p>There is no substitute for the usual university search methods: check out their websites, get information on specific institutions from government sources such as <a href="http://myuniversity.gov.au/">MyUniversity</a>, go on campus visits, attend open days and ask current students what they think. Your choice of university may have a significant impact on your life, so it is worth gathering the information needed to make a good decision.</p>
<hr>
<p><em>This piece is appearing as part of a series on Choosing a University. <a href="https://theconversation.com/au/topics/choosing-a-university">Read more pieces in the series here</a>. This topic will also be discussed on #TalkAboutIt on ABC News 24, iview and abc.net.au</em></p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/45699/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>David Carroll is employed as a Senior Research Associate at Graduate Careers Australia, who conducts the Australian Graduate Survey.</span></em></p><p class="fine-print"><em><span>Andrew Norton does not work for, consult, own shares in or receive funding from any company or organisation that would benefit from this article, and has disclosed no relevant affiliations beyond their academic appointment.</span></em></p>Your choice of university may have a significant impact on your life, so it is worth gathering the information needed to make a good decision.Andrew Norton, Program Director, Higher Education , Grattan InstituteDavid Carroll, PhD Candidate, UNSW SydneyLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.tag:theconversation.com,2011:article/455972015-08-24T19:42:42Z2015-08-24T19:42:42ZRankings, prestige, student experience: how to choose a ‘good’ university<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92647/original/image-20150821-15922-1ivsowx.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">Australia's universities all have pretty high standards, so how to pick one?</span> <span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/queenscollege/3309770091/">Queen's college/Flickr</a></span></figcaption></figure><p>When the <a href="http://www.shanghairanking.com/">Academic Ranking of World Universities</a> was released last week, more than half of Australia’s universities appeared in the highly prestigious top 500. That’s quite an extraordinary achievement for a country as small as ours, but might leave future students scratching their heads and wondering, well, was there something wrong with the others?</p>
<h2>Australian universities all have high standards</h2>
<p>Badging yourself as a university in Australia is protected by law and requires institutions to have robust quality control and meet strict standards, so none of our universities are poor quality – and certainly not prone to the kinds of issues besetting <a href="https://newmatilda.com/2015/01/27/greens-higher-ed-ante-amid-fresh-scandal-surrounding-private-college">elements of the private higher education sector</a>. </p>
<p><a href="https://theconversation.com/are-australian-universities-seldom-excellent-the-experts-respond-1535">The Economist claimed a few years ago</a> that:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Australia’s universities, like its wine, are decent and dependable, but seldom excellent.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>While that sentiment might play well to an <a href="https://theconversation.com/pynes-plan-isnt-the-way-to-protect-our-unis-from-mediocrity-32495">education minister bent on pushing</a> some institutions into the rankings stratosphere at the expense, in funding terms, of others, it is somewhat unfair. Historically, Australia has aimed to have an excellent university sector, rather than put all of its eggs into a few sandstone baskets.</p>
<p>The <a href="https://theconversation.com/cabinet-papers-1989-hawke-government-considered-interest-on-hecs-35419">Dawkins Reforms</a> of the late 1980s, which included the implementation of income-contingent loans, were aimed at creating a comprehensive system in which quality was widespread but diversity of institutional mission was encouraged. </p>
<p>To quite some extent, this aim has come to fruition. This is evident in the alliances made by universities according to the strengths they choose to focus on and the students they aim to serve: </p>
<ul>
<li><p>the Group of Eight (<a href="https://go8.edu.au">Go8</a>) comprises Australia’s older, Oxbridge-style institutions with big research profiles</p></li>
<li><p>the <a href="https://www.atn.edu.au">Australian Technology Network</a> universities are focused on industry collaboration and innovation</p></li>
<li><p>the <a href="http://www.run.edu.au/">Regional Universities Network</a> serves the regional and rural areas with education and research relevant to their locations</p></li>
<li><p>the <a href="http://www.iru.edu.au">Innovative Research Universities</a> are predominantly those created during the expansion of higher education in the 1960s and 70s, looking to step out from the shadow of the Go8 and lay claim to new and emerging research strengths.</p></li>
</ul>
<h2>Should we judge based on rankings?</h2>
<p>Most of the international rankings schemes are based heavily on <a href="https://theconversation.com/pynes-plan-isnt-the-way-to-protect-our-unis-from-mediocrity-32495">universitys’ research output</a>, not their teaching. Good teaching is very hard to measure or rank. In this sense, such rankings are not a good indicator of the kind of experience an aspiring student will have.</p>
<figure class="align-center zoomable">
<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92658/original/image-20150821-15913-kl49yt.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">Rankings are important for prestige, but not university experience.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">from www.shutterstock.com</span></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>Choosing based on rankings is not necessarily irrational – there is no doubt that status is an important part of signalling behaviour for job applicants. Beware, however, the (possibly apocryphal) story of the Princeton Law School, ranking very highly in a survey of perceived prestige – <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princeton_Law_School">despite not actually existing</a>. Status is real, but what is it really pinned to? </p>
<h2>A good university in Australia is one that’s good for you</h2>
<p>The diversity of “institutional missions” in Australia means that finding a good university, for students, means finding the university that’s good for you. Are you looking for an education you can fit around your other commitments and undertake online? </p>
<p>Is research reputation and status signalling important? Do you want to get involved with sport, theatre, the student newspaper? Do you want to consolidate knowledge and skills you already have, or open your mind to something completely new? </p>
<p>Do you mainly want to “do” things or “think” things? Probably, you’re looking for a combination of these, but once you have a better understanding of the balance, you can ask the questions to find out which institution offers what you want. </p>
<p>From a more personal point of view, people are <a href="http://www._cshe.unimelb.edu.au/research/rec_publications/FYE%202014%20FULL%20report%20-%20FINAL%20-%20web.pdf">much more likely to drop out</a> of courses that were low down their preference list, probably because they’re not intrinsically interested in them. </p>
<p>If you want to do well, you’re probably better off in a course that interests you at a university that might not have been your first choice, rather than taking a place in a course you’re not really drawn to at your dream university. </p>
<p>The main stumbling block into the future for Australia and its “good universities” is funding. By OECD standards, <a href="http://insidestory.org.au/the-university-rankings-no-government-wants-to-talk-about">Australian universities are poorly funded</a> (33rd out of 34 for public funding) and our fees are high (nearly twice the OECD average). </p>
<p>It’s a shame that so few outside the sector realise this because the good reputation of our universities may not last forever. </p>
<hr>
<p><br>
<em>This article is part of a Conversation series on <a href="https://theconversation.com/au/topics/choosing-a-university">Choosing a University</a>. This topic will also be discussed on #TalkAboutIt on ABC News 24, iview and abc.net.au</em></p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/45597/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>Emmaline Bexley does not work for, consult, own shares in or receive funding from any company or organisation that would benefit from this article, and has disclosed no relevant affiliations beyond their academic appointment.</span></em></p>All of the universities in Australia are of a high standard, so what makes them so good, and how do you choose between them?Emmaline Bexley, Lecturer in Higher Education, The University of MelbourneLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.tag:theconversation.com,2011:article/455842015-08-23T19:45:56Z2015-08-23T19:45:56ZFive things to think about when choosing a university course<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92022/original/image-20150817-5083-1gbq5tv.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">Prospective uni students often talk about "wasting their ATAR". Don't worry about that, it's not a thing. </span> <span class="attribution"><span class="source">from www.shutterstock.com.au</span></span></figcaption></figure><p>How do you choose the right university, or the right degree? The whole process can seem daunting. What should you focus on? How do you weigh up the different elements involved? So much seems to be at stake.</p>
<p>Students and their families often focus overwhelmingly on only some of the crucial aspects of choosing the right university, often missing other equally important, but less obvious, issues. So here I offer a few suggestions and tips about how best to think about choosing a university and a degree. Of course, each person’s situation is unique, but I hope I can provide some general guidance.</p>
<h2>1. Keep things in perspective</h2>
<p>Your life won’t be ruined if you don’t get into the university or degree of your absolute first choice. In fact, I think sometimes it’s positively healthy that you don’t. It forces you to think about what is really important to you, at least in terms of your education.</p>
<p>But even better, in Australia, we are fortunate to have an extraordinary range of high-quality universities in just about every part of the country. Many are in the top 1% of universities worldwide. That is truly amazing when you factor in that Australia accounts for only around 0.3% of the world’s population.</p>
<figure class="align-left zoomable">
<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92025/original/image-20150817-5103-zl0wuy.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">Go to university open days.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">from www.shutterstock.com</span></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>So before you even get started, you will have a fantastic array of high-quality universities and degrees to choose from. Each will have strengths and weaknesses and distinctive things on offer. So dream big. Explore different options. Don’t limit yourself to what your mates are talking about, or your Uncle Fred’s views about arts degrees. </p>
<p>Get out to as many open days and visit as many of the university websites as you can. When you visit, talk to the student volunteers as a matter of priority. In my experience, they can give you a real sense of the degree or course you’re interested in, as well as the general vibe of the campus.</p>
<p>Costs are obviously another important thing to consider. Tuition fees vary between different degrees, especially between some of the professional courses and more generalist ones. But there aren’t huge variations in tuition between Australian universities generally. </p>
<p>Living costs can vary, though, between different cities and towns. Living out of home for university can be a tremendous experience – whether in student accommodation on campus, or in shared housing. It’s a great way to make new friends and connect with fellow students from around the world. But that will depend on your financial circumstances. </p>
<p>Universities are investing more then ever in student scholarships and support. Ask early (and often) about the financial support on offer and pay close attention to their scholarship webpages, which are frequently updated. Don’t be shy. Universities want to attract the best students possible and we don’t want financial hurdles to get in their way.</p>
<h2>2. Treat entry scores with extreme caution.</h2>
<p>In Australia, we put a ridiculous amount of pressure on high school students for their final-year ranked results, which are used to define what counts as entry to the most “prestigious” degrees. As a dean, there was almost nothing more depressing than hearing students being told by their parents or friends not to “waste their ATAR”. That is bad advice.</p>
<figure class="align-center zoomable">
<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92023/original/image-20150817-5124-1ywmad8.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=503&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">Don’t make the mistake of just trying to match your course to your ATAR.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">from www.shutterstock.com</span></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>Of course, it’s a great achievement to have done well in your high school exams. You should feel very proud about that. But, as the economists would say, entry scores are a signal about the demand for a course, not its inherent quality. The entry requirement is a function of the number of places available and the number of students who want (or we expect to want) to do the degree. </p>
<p>That doesn’t mean degrees with lower entry scores are therefore necessarily less prestigious, or somehow less rigorous. For example, although arts and science degrees often have lower entry scores than professional degrees, in many cases, arts and science faculties are ranked just as highly in the various global university league tables, and sometimes even higher (although league tables are <a href="https://theconversation.com/what-do-world-university-rankings-actually-mean-32355">another thing to treat with caution</a>).</p>
<p>If you have your heart set on a double degree, for example, with a very high entry score you didn’t (or won’t) achieve, think about enrolling in a more generalist degree and then see if you can transfer in (especially if you were really close to the cut-off). </p>
<p>Even better, sometimes enrolling in a generalist degree gives you more options than a double degree offers. You can then top off your undergraduate degree with a master’s in the professional area of your choice. In fact, that is an increasing global trend: go broad at undergraduate, and then specialise at master’s.</p>
<h2>3. Focus on the big picture</h2>
<p>Focus on the overall university reputation and not just the particular faculty or school. So much of your university experience will take place outside your particular faculty, as much as within it.</p>
<p>So find out what the overall student experience is like. Do they have active student clubs and societies? Are there opportunities for international exchange, internships and work placements? Are there good support services for students, including libraries, sports facilities and health services?</p>
<p>Often the best sources of advice about these kinds of things are the various student guides available online (and the student volunteers I mentioned above), although you should always check with the university if you have any concerns or questions.</p>
<h2>4. Remember job-specific skills aren’t everything</h2>
<p>Try to remember that a university is not a job-training centre. Despite the overwhelming pressure today to think about your degree in terms of future employment, don’t let that overwhelm your decision-making (or that of your parents!). It is perfectly understandable that you will want to draw a tight connection between your degree and future employment. But there are two reasons why you should keep an open mind.</p>
<p>First of all, the world of work is changing rapidly. Many of the jobs that will be available when you graduate haven’t even been invented yet. Young people today are likely to go through five to seven major career changes over their lifetime. And this means a narrow, vocationally focused degree will not necessarily set you up best for the future. </p>
<figure class="align-right zoomable">
<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=384&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=384&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=384&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=483&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=483&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/92028/original/image-20150817-5127-1d4g4bw.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=483&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">The jobs of the future haven’t been invented yet, so don’t skill too specifically.</span>
<span class="attribution"><span class="source">from www.shutterstock.com</span></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>Of course, if you have your heart set on accountancy or chemical engineering and have the marks to do it – then go for it. But even engineering and business schools now realise how important it is for their students to learn a broad range of skills and to have their intellectual horizons expanded.</p>
<p>Even more importantly, the business leaders we work with at the University of Sydney have made clear that they are looking for well-rounded graduates – the kind of people who can keep learning, deal with change and contingency, understand context and communicate effectively.</p>
<p>So despite the ribbing at family barbecues about studying art history or quantum physics, you might just be doing the most practical thing you can to help set up your future career.</p>
<h2>5. Think about the value beyond dollars</h2>
<p>Finally, and probably most importantly, university is ultimately about an education for life, not just the next few years. So take the opportunity to push yourself – intellectually and socially.</p>
<p>Whether you are coming to university straight out of high school, or after working or raising a family, it’s best conceived as an exciting period for personal growth and intellectual expansion. It will help your career, I am sure – all the statistics make that clear – but the value is ultimately not something best captured in economic terms.</p>
<hr>
<p><em>This piece is appearing as part of a series on Choosing a University. <a href="https://theconversation.com/au/topics/choosing-a-university">Read more pieces in the series here</a>. This topic will also be discussed on #TalkAboutIt on ABC News 24, iview and abc.net.au</em></p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/45584/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>Duncan Ivison receives funding from the Australian Research Council. He is also on the editorial board of the Conversation.</span></em></p>How do you choose the right university, or the right degree? The whole process can seem daunting. What should you focus on? How do you weigh up the different elements involved?Duncan Ivison, Professor of Political Philosophy, Acting Deputy Vice Chancellor (Research), University of SydneyLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.tag:theconversation.com,2011:article/330082014-10-21T19:16:10Z2014-10-21T19:16:10ZDoes price matter when picking a university?<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62341/original/3dx37dd2-1413865789.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">When choosing which university to attend, price is not high on most Australians' list of priorities. </span> <span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="http://www.shutterstock.com/downloading_tips.mhtml?code=&id=156491909&size=medium&image_format=jpg&method=download&super_url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownload.shutterstock.com%2Fgatekeeper%2FW3siZSI6MTQxMzg5NDU1NSwiYyI6Il9waG90b19zZXNzaW9uX2lkIiwiZGMiOiJpZGxfMTU2NDkxOTA5IiwicCI6InYxfDEwMTI3NTg4fDE1NjQ5MTkwOSIsImsiOiJwaG90by8xNTY0OTE5MDkvbWVkaXVtLmpwZyIsIm0iOiIxIiwiZCI6InNodXR0ZXJzdG9jay1tZWRpYSJ9LCJ2RGNMMjFwbjZtS3dIRDF0blNrKzU1RFBvUW8iXQ%2Fshutterstock_156491909.jpg&racksite_id=ny&chosen_subscription=1&license=standard&src=c1BRAFuJ4n9m2l9OBWFb3A-1-128">Shutterstock</a></span></figcaption></figure><p>The <a href="http://parlinfo.aph.gov.au/parlInfo/search/display/display.w3p;query=Id%3A%22legislation%2Fbillhome%2Fr5325%22">proposed changes</a> to higher education, including the removal of caps on student fees, have led many to question what drives students to pick a university. In a deregulated market will universities compete solely on price, or will they find other means to attract students?</p>
<h2>Drivers of student choice</h2>
<p>Studies such as <a href="http://www.voced.edu.au/content/ngv20817">Which university? The factors influencing the choices of prospective undergraduates</a> repeatedly show that the field of education interests is dominant when students are picking a university. Having decided on an area of interest, such as physics, accounting or nursing, students then consider other factors such as course reputation, institution and location. </p>
<p>Before the demand-driven funding system was introduced, places were capped at a level lower than student demand. Through this period, students and institutions traditionally used the <a href="http://www.theaustralian.com.au/higher-education/melbourne-uni-study-finds-spend-effect-can-cost-students/story-e6frgcjx-1226716360354">ATAR as currency</a> to inform application and selection decisions. The role of higher education in influencing social status, and the role of students as co-producers of the higher education experience, meant that high-ATAR students would coalesce in particular institutions. </p>
<p>In today’s demand-driven system, eligible students can enrol in any institution that will offer them a place and ATAR is less influential than in the past. Non-school-leavers made up around <a href="http://docs.education.gov.au/system/files/doc/other/undergraduate_applications_and_offers_february_2014_0.pdf">43% of undergraduate offers in 2014</a> and institutions increasingly use <a href="http://www.salzburgglobal.org/fileadmin/user_upload/Documents/2010-2019/2014/537/Harvey__Andrew._Early_and_Delayed_offers_to_under-represented_university_students.pdf">alternatives to ATAR during selection</a>. </p>
<figure class="align-right zoomable">
<a href="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip"><img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=400&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=502&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=502&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62346/original/nd3vq724-1413867163.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=502&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px"></a>
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">Student experience is a factor when choosing a university.</span>
<span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="http://www.shutterstock.com/downloading_tips.mhtml?code=&id=130157549&size=small&image_format=jpg&method=download&super_url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownload.shutterstock.com%2Fgatekeeper%2FW3siZSI6MTQxMzg5NTkzMSwiYyI6Il9waG90b19zZXNzaW9uX2lkIiwiZGMiOiJpZGxfMTMwMTU3NTQ5IiwicCI6InYxfDEwMTI3NTg4fDEzMDE1NzU0OSIsImsiOiJwaG90by8xMzAxNTc1NDkvc21hbGwuanBnIiwibSI6IjEiLCJkIjoic2h1dHRlcnN0b2NrLW1lZGlhIn0sImdDcFZyU2FlSlprNEFqYWpYakpYUTZSanpHbyJd%2Fshutterstock_130157549.jpg&racksite_id=ny&chosen_subscription=1&license=standard&src=zrFn97BR6RpgAEifQLHapw-1-2">Shutterstock</a></span>
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</figure>
<p>ATAR remains an important signal in segments of the higher education market, but other factors like student experience increasingly come into play. The development of <a href="http://education.gov.au/upholding-quality-quality-indicators-learning-and-teaching">Quality Indicators for Learning and Teaching</a> recognises that access to information on student experience and graduate outcomes is important in assisting student decision-making. </p>
<p>The Australian approach is not dissimilar to that of England. The <a href="http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/hereview.independent.gov.uk/hereview/">Browne Report into higher education</a> in England recommended the easing of controls on student fees. It found that as higher education providers:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>depend on student willingness to pay for a significant proportion of funding, so providing a high-quality student experience is critical.</p>
</blockquote>
<h2>Surely price makes a difference?</h2>
<p>The Dawkins reforms marked an end to free higher education and the introduction of income-contingent loans. The last 25 years has produced a shift in the average proportion of higher education costs borne by students. Department statements during inquiry hearings indicated that <a href="http://parlinfo.aph.gov.au/parlInfo/search/display/display.w3p;db=COMMITTEES;id=committees%2Fcommsen%2F7634a65f-301e-4ee9-8932-99d7e5efd482%2F0008;query=Id%3A%22committees%2Fcommsen%2F7634a65f-301e-4ee9-8932-99d7e5efd482%2F0000%22">student attainment of 25 to 35 year olds has tripled over this time frame</a>. Cost, at least until now, has not been deterministic of participation, largely because of Australia’s income-contingent loan scheme.</p>
<p>There was no change to field-of-education preferences that occurred when <a href="http://studyassist.gov.au/sites/studyassist/helppayingmyfees/csps/pages/student-contribution-amounts">Student Contribution Amounts</a> were changed in the late 1990s from a low flat rate to the three bands in place today. Students are currently charged a per subject fee that varies by discipline, equating to around $6,000, $8,500 or $10,000 per year of study. Policies like <a href="http://studyassist.gov.au/sites/studyassist/payingbackmyloan/hecs-help-benefit/pages/hecshelpbenefit">HECS-HELP Benefit</a> that offer discounts for some disciplines have also had little effect.</p>
<p>Student fees do vary across institutions for full-fee students, so we can be confident that some prices will increase under deregulation. We may see price interact in new ways with the disciplinary interests of students and the purchasing power of their ATAR. </p>
<h2>Price competition</h2>
<p>The underlying logic of the reforms is that extending access to Commonwealth-supported places to more institutions and sub-bachelor programs will mean: accessibility will improve; competition will be enhanced; and the system will be more affordable for government. The costs of underwriting higher fees in some programs will be offset by lower costs in others and a 20% reduction in government contribution. </p>
<p>Some commentators suggest the reforms are an unsustainable <a href="https://theconversation.com/uncapping-education-fees-and-unleashing-the-unscrupulous-26810">blank cheque</a>. Others suggest that <a href="http://www.swinburne.edu.au/media-centre/news/2014/09/cap-help-loans-to-protect-students-from-unsustainable-fee-increases.html">limits to borrowing under FEE-HELP</a> may mitigate price rises.</p>
<p>The government is putting faith in the market to operate effectively and has rejected any caps on pricing. <a href="http://parlinfo.aph.gov.au/parlInfo/search/display/display.w3p;db=COMMITTEES;id=committees%2Fcommsen%2F7634a65f-301e-4ee9-8932-99d7e5efd482%2F0008;query=Id%3A%22committees%2Fcommsen%2F7634a65f-301e-4ee9-8932-99d7e5efd482%2F0000%22">Departmental statements</a> made during inquiry hearings indicate that caps may contribute to higher costs: </p>
<blockquote>
<p>… they could in fact have the perverse effect of dragging up prices for low-cost courses towards what might be perceived as the government-semaphored preferred pricing.</p>
</blockquote>
<h2>Pricing transparency</h2>
<p>In perfect competitive markets consumers and producers have perfect knowledge about price and quality. If institutions have freedom to set their fees in what is an imperfectly competitive market, ease of access to pricing information will become more important.</p>
<figure class="align-left ">
<img alt="" src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=237&fit=clip" srcset="https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=600&h=401&fit=crop&dpr=1 600w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=600&h=401&fit=crop&dpr=2 1200w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=600&h=401&fit=crop&dpr=3 1800w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&h=504&fit=crop&dpr=1 754w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=30&auto=format&w=754&h=504&fit=crop&dpr=2 1508w, https://images.theconversation.com/files/62347/original/6fh8bnxd-1413867261.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=15&auto=format&w=754&h=504&fit=crop&dpr=3 2262w" sizes="(min-width: 1466px) 754px, (max-width: 599px) 100vw, (min-width: 600px) 600px, 237px">
<figcaption>
<span class="caption">Scholarships don’t always go to those most in need.</span>
<span class="attribution"><a class="source" href="http://www.shutterstock.com/downloading_tips.mhtml?code=&id=171259883&size=small&image_format=jpg&method=download&super_url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownload.shutterstock.com%2Fgatekeeper%2FW3siZSI6MTQxMzg5NjAzOCwiYyI6Il9waG90b19zZXNzaW9uX2lkIiwiZGMiOiJpZGxfMTcxMjU5ODgzIiwicCI6InYxfDEwMTI3NTg4fDE3MTI1OTg4MyIsImsiOiJwaG90by8xNzEyNTk4ODMvc21hbGwuanBnIiwibSI6IjEiLCJkIjoic2h1dHRlcnN0b2NrLW1lZGlhIn0sImo5UUdEVm04UkYxUWVlS1c4ZzBtL0xsVTYyNCJd%2Fshutterstock_171259883.jpg&racksite_id=ny&chosen_subscription=1&license=standard&src=6rfldloO8KGpnNFyCoamCw-1-4">Shutterstock</a></span>
</figcaption>
</figure>
<p>University websites routinely publish their fees in advance. This is consistent with requirements under Section 6.2 of the <a href="http://www.comlaw.gov.au/Details/F2013C00169">Threshold Standards</a>.</p>
<p>What may be an emerging problem is the degree to which students within subjects are charged different fees. There is no evidence of conflict in programs where full-fee and Commonwealth-supported students rub shoulders. However, price competition may be undermined where students are unaware that their peers are driving a harder bargain or receiving larger inducements.</p>
<p>In the American higher education sector, where needs-blind admission practice is common, student fees vary considerably. <a href="http://www.deltacostproject.org/sites/default/files/products/Delta%20Cost_Trends%20College%20Spending%202001-2011_071414_rev.pdf">Discount rates between the gross and net tuition prices</a> are as high as 38% on average in some provider categories. There is also evidence that <a href="http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/magazine/september_october_2013/features/merit_aid_madness046453.php">discounts are increasingly applied to those least in need</a>.</p>
<p>The government has scope to improve transparency of pricing by publishing tuition fee statistics alongside Quality Indicators of Learning and Teaching.</p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/33008/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>Matt Brett is affiliated with La Trobe University, whose financing will be affected by the Higher Education and Research Reform Amendment Bill 2014</span></em></p>The proposed changes to higher education, including the removal of caps on student fees, have led many to question what drives students to pick a university. In a deregulated market will universities compete…Matt Brett, PhD Candidate and Senior Manager, Higher Education Policy, La Trobe UniversityLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.tag:theconversation.com,2011:article/207152014-01-20T03:01:42Z2014-01-20T03:01:42ZWhat makes a good teacher?<figure><img src="https://images.theconversation.com/files/37328/original/63sv8fmx-1386652503.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=496&fit=clip" /><figcaption><span class="caption">We've all had good teachers... and bad ones. But how do you define quality teaching?</span> <span class="attribution"><span class="source">Lecture image from www.shutterstock.com</span></span></figcaption></figure><p>Do you have a good university lecturer? What makes them good? Is it because they make their classes relevant? Are their lectures interesting or challenging? </p>
<p>Or maybe they’re just fun to be around?</p>
<p>Good quality teaching can be hard to define and there is no single way of measuring it. But all students, throughout their education, experience the highs and lows of teaching ability. </p>
<p>In my own case, my love of some subjects was destroyed by incompetent, boring and, at times, uncaring teachers. But others helped me develop a passion for a subject that I never thought I would be interested in. My good teachers were the most creative and served as role models. They mentored their class on a journey of lifelong learning.</p>
<p>In my own experience as both a teacher and a student, I’ve found there are some key skills that good quality teachers have in common. You need to be creative, enthusiastic, be clear and keep the information relevant. Those tired lecturers, who never vary from the same worn lecture notes or PowerPoint slides year after year until they reach retirement, do a great disservice to themselves, the students and their profession. </p>
<p>But is good (or bad) teaching something you can measure?</p>
<p>My field is statistics and the students I teach are, in the main, doing an MBA and have an average age of about 30, along with generally being in middle to high management positions. They do not want simply to be entertained, but actually want to learn something of substance that can be applied in the “real world”. Otherwise they see a course as a waste of their time and money.</p>
<p>Students surveys can be an imperfect indicator. But these mature students can distinguish a “quality” teacher from a “popular” one, who might present an easy course that can be passed with little effort. In this sense these students’ judgements generally coincide with what academic colleagues think about the teacher as well.</p>
<p>I undertook a five year study of these surveys that included an overall rating of the teacher, along with questions regarding the teacher’s knowledge, the class dynamics, the teacher’s preparedness, organisational skills, enthusiasm for the subject and teaching, availability outside class time and a number of other factors. </p>
<p>Although these responses all correlated to varying degrees with the overall rating given to the teacher, there was one question that was consistently most highly associated across all subjects areas over all the years. </p>
<p>This was the one that asked whether the teacher was able to explain the course material clearly. There were a number of instances where a teacher was rated enthusiastic, knowledgeable and well-prepared, but still was considered a poor teacher overall.</p>
<p>The conclusion from this study was that if you cannot explain the concepts in a way that the audience can understand, it doesn’t matter what else you do. In this case, they will not enjoy the experience but leave frustrated. </p>
<p>Whenever I introduce a new topic, particularly if it is complex, into the lecture room, I am fully aware that although I have been familiar with it for many years, it is the first time that most of them will have heard it. And during my explanation I think to myself, “if I had been hearing this for the first time, would I have understood what I just said?”. </p>
<p>Sometimes the answer is no, and so I then go through it again in a slightly different way. I need to be satisfied that at least the majority of students have understood the principles and, of course, I always encourage questions at any time. </p>
<p>Whether a teacher has been effective or not naturally depends on just what the student has learned from the experience. A teacher might rate well immediately after a course is completed, but several years down the track when the student looks back they may find what they learned of little value or relevance.</p>
<p>This often means that they have retained next to nothing not long after the final exam, did not develop a passion to explore the field further or find any use for it in later life. To me that is a great shame. </p>
<p>Although students may not always remember what you teach them, they will always remember their outstanding lecturers and how good they made them feel about the subject. That is their greatest gift and the mark of a good teacher.</p>
<hr>
<p><em>This piece is appearing as part of a series on Choosing a University. <a href="https://theconversation.com/au/topics/choosing-a-university">Read more pieces in the series here</a>. This topic will also be discussed on #TalkAboutIt on ABC News 24, iview and abc.net.au</em></p><img src="https://counter.theconversation.com/content/20715/count.gif" alt="The Conversation" width="1" height="1" />
<p class="fine-print"><em><span>John Croucher does not work for, consult, own shares in or receive funding from any company or organisation that would benefit from this article, and has disclosed no relevant affiliations beyond their academic appointment.</span></em></p>Do you have a good university lecturer? What makes them good? Is it because they make their classes relevant? Are their lectures interesting or challenging? Or maybe they’re just fun to be around? Good…John Croucher, Professor of Statistics at Macquarie Graduate School of Management, Macquarie UniversityLicensed as Creative Commons – attribution, no derivatives.